How to Network Without Feeling Fake: What to Say at Networking Events, Networking Tips, and How to Follow Up with Nicki Ketcham

If networking events make you feel awkward, fake, or completely exhausted, you probably don't need to become better at "working the room." You need a better plan for what to do once you get there.

In this episode of With Hat and Cattle, host Dani Raschel Chou sits down with Nicolle "Nicki" Ketcham, who helps professional service firms look more polished and communicate their brand online, for a practical networking-from-the-trenches conversation. They cover how to prepare for a networking event, what to say when you know nobody, how to network as an introvert, how to make better introductions, how to leave a conversation gracefully, and how to follow up without sounding like a sales robot.

TL;DR

The point of networking is not to meet everybody in the room. It is to make it easier for the right people to remember you, trust you, and eventually help each other.

Nicki's rule for measuring a successful networking event is surprisingly small: three meaningful conversations. Not 30 business cards.

Prepare before you go, ask better questions once you are there, listen long enough to learn something useful, make introductions when you can, and follow up within 24 to 48 hours in your own voice.

Key Takeaways

• Networking is happening more often than you think. A professional mixer counts, but so do church, a run club, your workplace, the mall, a golf lesson, and almost anywhere people are talking to each other. Every interaction can become an opportunity to build a relationship.

• Do a little homework before you walk into the room. Check the guest list if one is available. Look for people you already know, people you would genuinely like to meet, and the person hosting the event. Arriving early can make the room easier to navigate.

• Business cards can still be useful when you use them as memory tools. Include enough information that someone can remember why they met you, choose paper you can write on, and jot down a note after the conversation.

• No business card? Use LinkedIn. Pull up your LinkedIn QR code, connect, and add a short message reminding both of you where you met.

• Stop opening every conversation with "What do you do?" Ask what someone is working on that they are excited about, how they got into their line of work, or who would be a helpful person for them to meet.

• The follow-up question matters more than your next story. When someone shares something interesting, resist the urge to immediately pivot back to yourself. Ask one more question.

• If follow-up questions are hard, practice mirroring. Repeat the important final words or idea the other person just shared and give them room to continue.

• Your elevator pitch only needs to answer two questions. Who do you help, and how do you help them? Specific beats a generic job title.

• Learn how to leave a networking conversation. You are allowed to make the rounds. A practiced exit line lets you move on without apologizing.

• Follow up within 24 to 48 hours and sound like yourself. Mention something specific from the conversation. AI can help you get past a blank page, but the final note should sound human.

• The best networkers are connectors. Listen closely enough to recognize when someone you know could help the person standing in front of you, then make the introduction with enough context for both people to take it from there.

• You are going to have awkward networking moments. Someone may dismiss you. You may forget a name. One uncomfortable interaction does not have to become your verdict on the entire room.

• If going alone feels overwhelming, phone a friend. Ask someone in your company who is good at networking to attend with you and show you how they navigate the room. Networking is a skill, and skills can be practiced.

  
  

Questions Answered

How do I prepare for a networking event?

Start before you arrive. Look through the attendee list if it is available and identify people you already know, people you would like to meet, and the person hosting the event. Arrive a few minutes early if you can. Bring business cards if you use them, preferably ones you can write on, and keep a pen nearby so you can jot down what you discussed.

How do you network when you're an introvert?

Do not make "work the room" the assignment. Start small. Nicki suggests approaching somebody who is standing alone, because there is a good chance they are hoping somebody will come talk to them too. Another option is to stand near a natural stopping point like the drink station, where newly arrived people are already looking around for someone to talk to.

What should I say when I don't know anyone at a networking event?

You do not need a brilliant opening line. Introduce yourself. Ask whether they have been to the event before. Tell them you are new and ask who they recommend you meet. Or skip "What do you do?" and try: What are you working on that you're excited about? How did you get into your line of work? Who would be a helpful person for you to meet?

How do I make networking feel less fake or transactional?

Change the question from "What can I get?" to "Who can I help?" Listen for the project someone is working on, the problem they are trying to solve, or the person they wish they knew. If somebody in your network can help, make the introduction.

What should my elevator pitch say?

Keep it short enough that you can actually remember it. Nicki recommends answering two things: Who do you help? How do you help them? Her own version is specific: she helps professional service firms look more polished and communicate their brand online.

How do I keep a networking conversation going?

Listen long enough to ask the next question. When someone tells you something interesting, resist the urge to answer with a story about yourself. Ask one more question about what they just said. If that does not come naturally yet, try mirroring the last important phrase they used and giving them room to go deeper.

How do I remember people's names at networking events?

Use the person's name naturally during the conversation. If you forget it, ask again. Waiting while secretly trying to reconstruct the name usually makes things more awkward. Own it early and move on.

How do I politely end a conversation at a networking event?

Have a line ready before you need it. Nicki uses lines like, "I'm going to keep making the rounds, but I'd love to stay in touch," or, "I don't want to monopolize you, but this was such a great conversation." Notice what is missing: an apology.

When should I follow up after a networking event?

Nicki recommends 24 to 48 hours later. Mention where you met and something specific you talked about. You do not need an immediate business reason to contact them. A genuine note saying it was great to meet them and that you would like to stay in touch can be enough.

How many people should I meet at a networking event?

Try three meaningful conversations. The number is not a magic formula. It is a way to change what you are measuring. Instead of counting how many cards you collected, focus on conversations where you actually learned something about another person, made one helpful introduction, or met one person you genuinely want to speak with again.

What if someone at a networking event clearly isn't interested in talking to me?

Leave the conversation. Dani shares a recent experience where an introduction went badly and she stayed in the interaction longer than she wishes she had. Looking back, she would have exited earlier and found somebody else who was actually interested in meeting her.

Can networking lead to opportunities outside of business?

Yes. Dani's Frisco King story starts with a genuine compliment at Dallas Meetup, not an elevator pitch. A conversation about fashion turned into a new connection, an Instagram follow, a casting call, and Dani finally applying for something she had wanted to try.

The Full Conversation

Below is the full conversation from the episode, lightly cleaned for line breaks and readability while preserving the substance of the discussion.

Nicki: We are networking all the time, whether we realize it or not. It's you're going to church, you're talking to somebody at the mall, you're at work, you're going to events, and yes, we have these structured networking events, but really every interaction is an opportunity to network.

Dani Raschel Chou: Welcome back to With Hat and Cattle. I am your host, Dani Raschel Chou. And I heard you. Ely Delaney's episode on networking for introverts, and then how we moved to the marketing, but then it really became a lesson in networking for all, really resonated with you.

So I said, "Okay, we're gonna pause on that, and we're gonna tell you stories about networking from the trenches."

And I say "we" because I have in studio with me my best friend, Nicolle Ketcham, Nicki Ketcham. Say hello.

Nicki: Hello, everybody. Great to be back.

Dani Raschel Chou: For anyone meeting Nicki for the first time, she helps professional service firms look more polished and communicate their brand online. She's also the person I call before I walk into a room full of strangers, which is exactly why she's here. All right, back to the show.

You were here when we were under Suite Mornings, and you spoke to networking way back then.

Nicki: I did. It's one of my favorite things.

Dani Raschel Chou: You were here just last week with the Rubin Brothers. Thank you so much for sitting with me on that conversation.

Nicki: If you have not already listened to that episode, just go back. Go back and listen to it. They are two of the coolest, most fun, and interesting people with such great outlooks on business and how to approach life.

Dani Raschel Chou: It, it was amazing. It was so, so joyful. And now we've- we're gonna go see them in concert together. I mean, life is good.

Nicki: Life is really good.

Dani Raschel Chou: To speak to networking from the trenches, I have a background in city planning, so before I went to become a consultant, right?

I didn't really begin networking until about 2021, 2022, getting my feet wet. You have much more, much more of a background in networking.

Nicki: I mean, I... There's still something to the fact that going to a structured networking event and the added pressure that that brings, we all have to start somewhere. We all are beginners at some point. We did not pop out of the womb ready to go network.

So I think there's no wrong way to start as long as you get out there.

Dani Raschel Chou: Mm.

Nicki: People are craving authenticity and connection, and I'm really hoping and confident that some of these things are going to help people build those connections and start leading to those deeper conversations that they're looking for.

Dani Raschel Chou: When you, you spoke to that and my mind went to run clubs. The running community has exploded, and I'm seeing online one of the reasons for that is people are craving community, but especially Gen Z.

They are the ones leading this charge on going offline and getting into the world again. So the tips that we are gonna share today, take them into those offline settings like run club, like church.

Nicki: You actually remind me, run clubs and things like that, one of the best things is consistency. When you find a group that you're resonating with and you're, you're starting to feel that connection, go back.

Go back and continue building those relationships. Repetition, it's going to help you feel better, build and deepen relationships and connections, and you'll start feeling more comfortable and more confident, especially when you branch out to new events.

Dani Raschel Chou: We're gonna s- we're gonna stay on run club for just a second, but in a moment we are gonna offer some takeaways when you go to a structured networking event.

One of, for some reason, what run clubs love to do is if it's your first time, you get into the inner circle and introduce yourself. Do you have any advice for the introverted runner who it took so much effort just to go to run club, and now they have to introduce themselves?

Nicki: Yes. That can be so stressful. They do this at a lot of networking events, and it sounds like at run clubs as well. Keep it short, keep it sweet. You know who you are. "Hi, my name is Nicki Ketcham. I am happy to be here." Period. Shut up. You've done it. You said the thing.

Whenever you show up to an event, whatever that event may be, I believe it's crucial to remember whatever you think that you are so embarrassed by, nobody else cares.

Nobody else is going to remember. The only one who's going to remember is you. What you wore that day, what your hair looked like, whether or not you had a blowout, nobody else is going to remember. You said something not exactly right, nobody's going to remember. People are way too focused on themselves.

So just try and go out there and have a little fun with it. Just like when you show up to a networking event, you may not be the smartest one in the room.

Dani Raschel Chou: Let's talk about the pre-work before you go to a networking event. You are really big on this. Make sure you have your business cards.

Nicki: Yes. Number one, make sure you have business cards. And this may sound rudimentary to say, but your business card should have your name, what your company does some way explained on that card, your phone number, your email.

That's what you need to have so that when somebody picks it up later, they can go, "Oh, that's right, I met Dani Chou. Dani Chou runs a podcast." And it's easy for them to connect the dots or think, "Oh, I need to keep this card for later."

Dani Raschel Chou: S- if someone hasn't yet created their business card or printed their business card, a tip that you gave me that I've taken to heart is print it on a paper that you can write on.

Because when you are at the event and you give someone your business card, you can also encourage them to write, "Oh, this is where we met," if you wanna note that down, for example, because we take for granted that we're gonna remember. But at some of these big networking events, we can come back with a lot of cards.

Nicki: Oh, 100%. Anytime I'm at a networking event, one of the number one things I do is I have a pen handy, usually in a tiny purse or in a pocket. I always try to make sure that I make it as easy on myself as possible. So as a woman, usually we'll have a dress. Dresses have pockets? No, most of the time. So I wear something that has pockets, or I have an easy purse where I have quick and easy access to my business cards and to a pen so that after I have a conversation with you, Dani, I can jot down, "Oh, we discussed going on a podcast and talking about networking events next week," so that I can recall that later whenever I look at her business card.

Dani Raschel Chou: That has been so invaluable. I have used that so many times now because your girl's getting older. My memory ain't what it used to be, and I'd love to remember everyone just like that, but it, it doesn't happen that, that way.

Nicki: And I, I do wanna remind people, if you do not have your business cards, if you have forgotten your business cards.

Dani Raschel Chou: It happens.

Nicki: I actually... Yes, it happens. I went to the PGA last week, also not conducive to walking around with business cards, um, but I did. I left my business cards in my car, and I happened to be having such a great conversation with this young woman who works at just the coolest company, and she was like, "Oh, can I get your business card?"

And I had that moment where I go, "Oh no, I left my business cards in the car." Pivot, have your QR code for your LinkedIn page ready to go. So for those of you who don't know, hopefully you have LinkedIn on your phone. Most people do. It's a easy app. Up at the top in the search bar, whenever you click it, there's a place for you to pull up or scan somebody else's QR code in LinkedIn.

That'll automatically bring up their profile or your profile, and you can connect. Easiest way to get that connection with somebody. And I also highly recommend whenever you do connect with somebody on LinkedIn, whether it's at that moment or you connect with them later, include a message like, "Hey, it was so great to meet you at the PGA networking event."

Because then whenever you go back and look at your messages later, you could say, "Oh, that's right, I met Jessica at the PGA event." And it's easier for you to make those, those connections and remember the context of meeting them.

Dani Raschel Chou: And this has happened to me. You go to an event, your phone service doesn't work, and so LinkedIn isn't pulling up.

I have been fortunate that it's either my LinkedIn that's not pulling up or the other person's. But you'll still have access to, to one. So the other person is taking a picture of my profile, or I'm taking a picture of theirs. Now the work there is when you finally have service, go back and connect with the people on there.

But that's another workaround of not having the business card, and then for some reason not being able to pull up LinkedIn to connect with the person in that moment.

Nicki: Yes. Okay, so let's go back to talking about before the before work. Okay. Whenever you're getting ready for the networking event, I love to take a few minutes to just go through and see who else is signed up for the event. I really look for people who I've met previously but I haven't connected with in a while.

Those are people I'm like, yes, I wanna make a point to go by and speak to, um, Bobby Joe Smith and let them know, what's, what's new, what new has been happening, and also ask about, ask about them.

Dani Raschel Chou: Right.

Nicki: Also, it's a great time to look for who are those people I really wanna get in front of and build a connection with.

Dani Raschel Chou: Mm-hmm.

Nicki: Also, definitely take a few minutes to figure out who is hosting the event. It's so important. The person that is hosting the event. I also love to try and get to an event a few minutes early. It's such... And I think Ely spoke to this, too. Pro tip, try and get to the event early or, like, right there at the beginning so that you have the opportunity to go and meet, find, meet, introduce yourself to the host of the event.

And great opportunity to thank them for putting the event on.

Dani Raschel Chou: Yes. So we are now in the room. We have moved from doing pre-work, and we are feeling ourselves. We are gonna go. We're gonna have a great time. There's no negative self-talk allowed in the pre-work. If you're, if you are talking negatively to yourself, put on a song that'll hype you up and go into the room.

And as you mentioned, we're early, so we're gonna have a chance hopefully to meet the host. And then what'll happen?

Nicki: Usually there is a spot where you need to sign in, and you're going to get a name tag. That's usually the very first stop. So go get the name tag. The thing, easy 101, people don't even think about it.

Actually put it on the right-hand side towards the top so when you extend your right hand, the person's eyes naturally travel up your arm and see the name tag.

Dani Raschel Chou: So I'm gonna share an embarrassing moment here. I went to an event on Wednesday night, and I knew it was gonna be a low-key event. It wasn't going to be one that I needed to wear a dress for or, you know, a blouse and a blazer.

So I wore jeans and a tank top, essentially. And tank tops will come, the straps will come in all, all sizes, all widths, and it wasn't, it wasn't a spaghetti strap, but it was one that was not conducive to putting a name tag, and it ended up a bit lower. Let's just say it ended up near a location I do not want the eye to naturally travel to.

Dani Raschel Chou: I do want the eye to be further up near my clavicle and near my shoulder. So be, be aware when you're, you are gonna need to wear a name tag, so your choice of clothing, make sure it's conducive to putting a name tag on there.

Nicki: Yes, and whenever you're writing your name, large, clear letters. I know there's quite a few, folks that work in the business world that maybe they should've been a doctor in another life, and they have that doctor scratch.

Dani Raschel Chou: Uh, this is not, not a time to practice cursive either.

Nicki: No, definitely not. I suggest doing all capital letters, just all capital, big block letters. Make sure people can see and read it.

Dani Raschel Chou: And when you have the name tag on, I know I have a tendency to play with my hair, so I'll move it forward, or I may move it off the shoulder.

Make sure your name tag is visible at all times.

Nicki: Certainly. Next up, once we've gotten our name tag, we've already talked to the host of the event, next we are obviously going to the drink bar. Right? You gotta get your drink. So I always advise people, put your drink in your left hand so that your right hand is open to shaking a hand, because nobody likes a wet, clammy, cold hand.

Dani Raschel Chou: And if you've already had it in your right hand, it's okay. Don't stress about it. Just move it over to the left. It'll warm up eventually.

Nicki: Yes. And if you're carrying a plate, find a table. Yeah. It is okay. Get a table, set your plate down, set your drink down, because you need to be open and able to network, to shake hands, to hand somebody your business card.

Dani Raschel Chou: Yes. So one tip that many people will say is to find someone who is standing off by themselves, kind of... One, I feel it's a nice icebreaker for me to kind of get warmed up. As someone who I've recently learned, I've always thought of myself as introverted because when... It's the whole the, how you get your energy, right?

You know, extroverts will go into a room and it totally ups the battery, and introverts can go into a room and work it, but then they leave the room and they're taking the next 24 hours to recharge. So I've found out that I'm an ambivert, where when I'm plugged in with the right people, it fills my cup.

It actually does bring energy. So that, that being said, sometimes you'll go into these rooms and you'll see an introvert, they're off by themselves. It's a great way to go and break the ice if you're an introvert, but also help them get warmed up and get ready to own the room.

Nicki: Yes. Please, don't be afraid to be the person that walks up to somebody else standing there by themselves.

They are probably going to be so grateful that you walked over and saved them from loneliness. Another great, great option is to hang out. You just went and got your drink. You have it in your left hand. You've wandered away a little bit. If you stand somewhere near that drink station, somebody else is about to follow that exact same path, where they went and got their name tag, and they went to the drink station, and then they're going to turn around and look like deer in the headlights.

"Oh, no. Who do I talk to now?" Guess what? You're the hero. You're gonna be the one that says, "Hello. I also just arrived." And you can introduce yourself and build that connection, and it's gonna be another way that you've actually built a connection and helped somebody ease into the situation.

Dani Raschel Chou: Now, question.

When you walk up to a person, do you, you immediately go into your elevator pitch?

Nicki: Oh, the elevator pitch. Okay. Elevator pitch I believe is important in that you have to have it ready when somebody asks you the question, what do you do? That being said, people get so tired of that question. If you would like to level up your networking game, have a different question ready to get into the conversation because people get in that mindset where they're just giving you the thing that comes right off the top of their head, and that can get boring.

Dani Raschel Chou: And you could be doing yourself a disservice because they may think, "Oh, I don't need to talk to this person," and they won't get the opportunity to just see how cool you are, and you won't get to see how cool they are.

Nicki: Exactly. So I like to try and have a few questions prepared ahead of time that I can ask somebody when I meet them, and hopefully learn something new about them, dive a little bit deeper than whatever's on the surface.

So some questions I really enjoy are, what are you working on that you're excited about? How did you get into your line of work? 'Cause usually that journey can be very interesting. I think this podcast is a great example of that. You talk to all these people that have an amazing journey to share and so much knowledge, and just opening up the question allows you to find that.

Um, one of my favorites is, who would be a helpful person for you to meet?

Dani Raschel Chou: Mm.

Nicki: Cause one of the greatest gifts that we can do is be connectors.

Dani Raschel Chou: Yes. 100%. When I'm talking to someone and meeting them for the first time, depending on the vibes I get from the beginning, I s- if we already are kind of bantering from the get-go, a question I'll go to is, "How did you fail this week?"

Dani Raschel Chou: And--

Nicki: Ooh, that's a good one.

Dani Raschel Chou: It is. One, if they're open to being vulnerable, 'cause some people can automatically put up a wall, but then that leads to the natural, then this tells me that you're trying new things, that you're pushing yourself out of your comfort zone. And, I mean, I feel people like to be told that.

People like to be reminded, yeah, I'm not part of the status quo. I'm actually doing something to level up my life, and sometimes questions like that help frame the work that they're doing, and it's a nice reminder to them that, oh yeah, I'm actually, I'm actually doing things to improve. That's... And maybe helps them see failure in a different way.

Nicki: I love the way that you brought that up, and I believe a lot of times when somebody hears that failure story, their first instinct and response is, "Oh my gosh, here is how I failed too," immediately pivoting it back to yourself.

Dani Raschel Chou: Mm-hmm.

Nicki: I would say, pro tip, one of the best things you can do, don't immediately start talking about yourself.

Ask the follow--

Dani Raschel Chou: It's so hard.

Nicki: It is so hard, but ask the follow-up question. Go just one layer deeper. So when that they, whenever somebody opens up and tells you about how they completely messed up the production line at work this week, and they are now behind schedule three weeks, ask a follow-up question.

Ask the, "Oh my gosh, that sounds like it was so hard. What do you guys have going in place to fix this right now?" Or, "Do you see this turning around any time soon? Uh, what sort of things have you put in place to prevent it from happening in the future?" Ask that other question and show interest.

Dani Raschel Chou: And so- this, what this is also telling you is their pain point, and if it's something that you can't help with, you're probably gonna know someone who can.

And then, again, that leads to the natural, being a natural connector. Like, "Oh, well, you're struggling with operations? You need to speak to this person. You want to learn a way to implement AI and actually deploy it? You need to talk to this person." So getting themselves just to open up naturally Can help identify the pain point.

Whereas if you were s- just specifically to ask, "What are your pain points?" They're immediately gonna think you're trying to sell me something.

Nicki: Right. The best networkers are connectors. That requires you to listen, just like you were talking about. Like, we have two ears and one mouth. Maybe we need to use those proportionately.

So as you're listening, it's an opportunity to help figure out, oh, here's how I can help this person, and by connecting them is one of the best ways you can do it. And whenever you do that, make sure to introduce the person and give some context. So

Dani Raschel Chou: Before we move there, Nicki.

Nicki: Yeah.

Dani Raschel Chou: Cause for some people, it can be hard to ask that, that follow-up question.

One, we have the attention spans of gnats nowadays, and that's not just, you know, it's a lot of the social media and algorithms and things that now have been introduced into our lives. As someone who has worked on communication skills in marriage to help improve marriage, one tip, one technique that you can do that sounds so easy, but it can actually be challenging, is mirroring.

So, and you know this. Mirroring? Mirroring. Yeah, exactly. Um, mirroring is when... It's, one, it's a hard word to say once you actually get to say it. There's so many Rs. It's where you just repeat the last thing of what the person said.

Nicki: The last thing somebody said?

Dani Raschel Chou: Exactly. Thank you for being my Exhibit A.

Nicki: You're welcome. It, it opens people up to dive deeper into that next level. I'm glad you brought that up. It's such an easy way to show that you're listening and get to the next layer.

Dani Raschel Chou: It is so easy, but it can feel awkward. So one thing that my husband and I did at the beginning where we were... And I guess I should preface by saying I learned all these communication skills before my current marriage as a way to help get ready and be a good partner It could be you could take some time with your spouse or with a friend and actually practice mirroring.

And we would sit down at the kitchen table and talk. I was like, "Oh, this is my cup of coffee." And he would say, "Cup of coffee?" And it just, it sounds funny, and it sounds awkward, but it's good practice for real-life situation. You don't wanna practice techniques that you're picking up sometimes in the moment.

You do wanna take some time and practice it on your own with someone that you trust and are comfortable with.

Nicki: My husband is actually the master of this. He can go to a party. All he does the entire night is mirror people. He's never told you one thing about him, and yet at the end of the party, my husband is somehow the most interesting man there.

Dani Raschel Chou: I have been witness to this.

Nicki: It's an amazing... It's, it's kinda like a party trick.

Dani Raschel Chou: Before, before we went off and, and spoke to follow-up questions and things, I did wanna take a moment just to, to pause and tell people again, it's okay to practice this. You're a- you're just building up your confidence.

Nicki: And it's even okay to say that to people you meet at the networking events. " I'm new to this networking event. Is there anybody you would recommend that I talk to?" Or, "I'm new to this networking event. I would love if you could tell me a little bit about your experience here, or tell me how you make the most of these events."

Ask them for their advice. People love giving advice.

Dani Raschel Chou: Yeah, they do. I mean, I host a podcast. I'm just kidding. All right, so follow-up questions, friend.

Nicki: Okay, so we asked the follow-up questions. Um, then absolutely introduce somebody if you get the opportunity to, and make sure to give some context so that they have a starting place.

You wanna make it easy for them. So, you know, "Dani, this is Chad. You both work with growing construction firms, so I really thought you guys should meet." And then have the handoff. Let them, you know, meet each other, greet each other, and then you can exit your way out of the conversation or continue and be part of the conversation.

Um, I will say, though, one of the best things for those introverts that they often forget about is the exit strategy.

Dani Raschel Chou: We're speaking to networking from the trenches, so, and you know this. I recently went to a networking event where someone introduced me to another person.

Now, the introduction itself was awkward. The, the other woman was already speaking to someone, and it was obvious they were friends. And when this gentleman introduced me, it was already, as I mentioned, awkward. She wasn't really listening, and then he just left. So the handoff was awkward.

She- I'm- she was trying to just not be rude, but it was still coming off as rude.

It was the worst feeling, and I, I'll be honest, it did. It defeated me. I did not want to stay at the event, and I just left. So in those moments where inevitably you'll find yourself meeting someone who really doesn't wanna meet you, and there have been moments in the past where I've spoken to someone, and I could tell he had already written me off as not a decision-maker, so I wasn't worth his time.

Dani Raschel Chou: It didn't bother me. I... You know, there was, there's other people there who I can connect with, who I can meet, who I can help meet other people, and that kept me going at that event. This time, I just went home.

Nicki: Knowing what you know now and looking back on that event and what happened, is there anything you would've done differently in that moment?

Dani Raschel Chou: I think I would have left faster once I realized... I mean, left the, the situation faster. Once I picked up, oh, like she's, she's written me off. I don't need to be here. There's other people that I can meet that would be happy to meet me I, I think about that. I don't-- I still can't fully answer why I still stayed in the moment.

I don't know if it's the people please, the recovering people pleaser in me who just needed acceptance. I have no idea. But we're about to speak to exit strategies and things of that nature. But I wanted to share this story of being in that moment because it, it, it's gonna happen. It's not a question of if, but when.

It's okay to feel human. And if you need to, again, step out of the event to collect yourself, take- give yourself grace. Many times we speak to giving other people grace and holding space for others when we can forget we need to hold space for ourselves, especially when we're in situations that are pushing us out of our comfort zones.

Nicki: 100%. We should give ourselves grace, and also remember how cool you are for a minute. Just give yourself props. You went there to the thing. You did the hard thing. And in the words of Kacey Musgraves, "You are not everybody's cup of tea." Mm. And that is okay. And when you run into those people, because inevitably they do exist, you can't be everything to everybody.

Write them off and move on, ' cause they are out there. But you know what? There are too many good people in this world who wanna talk with you and wanna be in your circle and wanna build a community with you to waste any time on that. Ain't nobody got time for that.

Dani Raschel Chou: No time. All right, friend, back to more tips. Okay. And again, if you have moments that you would love to share... Of course, as we both know, I'm the Enneagram Four, so I'm fully ready to, to share all these stories- ... all these emotional moments. And as my Enneagram Three friend who wants to come off as poised and polished and perfect, please feel free to share moments where networking went well and maybe it fell on its face.

Nicki: Oh, gosh. Um, just thinking back to being a young person in college and going through sorority recruitment, you have to talk to seems like thousands of people, I'm sure it was just hundreds, through an entire day, asking questions, getting to know people. You get those awkward pauses. You... Those things happen.

Um, best thing that you can do now, looking back on that, be ready to ask good questions. I know a lot of introverts struggle with confidence and talking about themselves or bragging about themselves. My favorite way to flip that on its head is ask people about themselves. Be the first one with the question.

I love just having questions ready and asking people about themselves. Um, it's such a great way to build a connection and, quite frankly, fill the silence when things gets aw- get awkward.

Dani Raschel Chou: Um- Let's go back to the elevator pitch because there, once you get s- speaking with someone, I can remember an event we went to where the first question you were asked was, " Have you been on any interesting trips lately?"

And this comes to mind 'cause I remember you telling me, oh, you weren't prepared for that, one, and two, you actually did have an interesting trip coming up. You were going to Big Bend.

Nicki: Yes. That was such a cool conversation, and it actually, A, it generated me getting introduced to somebody else because when I told them I was getting ready to go to Big Bend, they were like, "Oh my gosh, you need to be introduced to Chad."

And so took me over and introduced me to Chad.

Dani Raschel Chou: Your husband who was also going?

Nicki: I'm just kidding. No. It was another Chad who was in the industry. And it, it was just such an interesting conversation and a fun conversation, and it's ex- it's always great when you see somebody else get excited when they're talking about something that they're passionate about because this guy Chad was like pumped about Big Bend.

Like I, I left that conversation with a whole list of things to get excited about when I was going on my upcoming trip, so have interesting and fun questions ready. You never know where it's going to lead. Right now we're getting ready for a trip to Thailand, and in my wildest dreams I would never have guessed how many people just one or two degrees of separation away from me have been to Thailand and have great ideas and information and recommendations, and I'm just like, oh my gosh, apparently I'm the only one who had no idea that Thailand's the place to go.

Dani Raschel Chou: Apparently I did not know this either.

Nicki: But to your question about an elevator pitch, keep it short and sweet. You need to be able to remember it. I love to think about it in two parts. Who do you help, and how do you help them?

Dani Raschel Chou: Mm.

Nicki: So for instance, I help professional service firms look more polished and communicate their brand online.

So people are already thinking about what you do in terms of the solution instead of just you're a person who does marketing. Well, a bunch of people do marketing, but who else does marketing like I do marketing?

Dani Raschel Chou: Exactly. No one. I can attest to that. My website looks amazing.

Using a person's name in the conversation. People have such attachment to their names. If you speak, if you said people love to talk about themselves, people also love to hear their name.

Nicki: They do love to hear their name. One of the best tips I ever heard was somebody saying they try to use the person's name at least three times in the conversation.

Just naturally in the course of the conversation, "Dani, that was hilarious. I can't believe you went to the mall and tripped."

Dani Raschel Chou: Gracefully, I might add.

Nicki: Always. Always gracefully. Um, but yes, figure out ways to use their name in context, and if you miss their name or have forgotten their name, the best thing you can do is ask about it sooner rather than later.

The longer you let it go on, the more awkward it gets. So if they introduce themselves and you didn't hear it, just say, "I'm so sorry. I didn't catch that. Could you say that one more time?" Um, and during the conversation, you can, you're sitting there and you're thinking, "What is their name?" You can actually say, "Okay, I know you told me your name at the beginning of this conversation.

Could you... But I have forgotten it. Could you tell me one more time?" People are okay telling you their name again. They know it's hard to remember all these different names when you're at events.

Dani Raschel Chou: Yes. There was a ti- there was this one event I went to. I introduced myself to this gentleman. I was like, "Hi, I'm Dani.

You know, is this your first time here?" And he said, "No, I've actually met you, like, at three other events." So I have for- I had introduced myself to this person previously three times and still could not remember his name, and I just owned it. I said, "Oh my gosh, I'm so sorry. I am going to make a better effort to remember your name."

His name is Jason. I have not forgotten.

Nicki: And you know what? You're not alone. I'm just gonna say I've done the same thing. I even did that to a person I worked with, a coworker I had been working with for months. I was like, " Oh, do I know you?" And they're like, "I work here with you." And I was like, " Oh." It's okay.

It happens, guys. Just own it.

Dani Raschel Chou: Just the, the less awkward to make it, the better.

Nicki: Yes.

Dani Raschel Chou: Just, just own it and, and move on, and hopefully it'll be a funny story-

Nicki: Yes. Okay.

Dani Raschel Chou: ... years later.

Nicki: Whenever you're in the conversation, you're talking to people at these networking events, make sure you're present in the conversation.

Like, make eye contact. Not a weird staring contest. Make eye contact. Show that you're interested. There are people... All these little subtle things people pick up on, like when you keep looking at your watch or you keep looking around the room. That, that signals to somebody, "Oh, they don't feel like I'm important or worth their time."

Dani Raschel Chou: Right. Right. And again, at, at the end of the day, when you go to these networking events, you would love to be remembered as someone who is a connector and who makes people feel welcomed and like they are taking up their space professionally and, you know, I'll say gracefully.

Nicki: Yes, which is why we need to perfect the exit strategy.

Dani Raschel Chou: Mm.

Nicki: Southern hostesses are the best at this, okay? They're so good at that little thing that signals to everybody, "You need to get out of my house for the night because we're shutting down." Um, but have your personal exit strategy. And yes, again, practice it so it feels natural. I have a few really good exit lines I like to have, again, in my back pocket that I practice so that it doesn't feel weird and awkward.

Dani Raschel Chou: Tell us.

Nicki: Um, so one, " I'm going to go grab a refill," obviously from the drink bar that we were at earlier. "I'm going to grab a refill, but I really enjoyed meeting you." Number two, " I'm going to keep making the rounds, but I'd love to stay in touch." So it shows that you're still interested and you enjoyed the conversation, but you're also, it's time to exit.

Uh, number three, "I don't wanna monopolize you, but this was such a great conversation." ' Cause it also acknowledges that their time is important and valuable.

Dani Raschel Chou: Yes.

Nicki: Cause one of the things we don't wanna do is apologize for exiting. We are at a networking event to meet multiple people.

And so they're designed for people to circulate and make the rounds. Mm-hmm. You're doing the right thing by not taking all of their time and making sure you're giving everybody an opportunity to both meet you and meet the other person.

Okay, so once you've exited, you've made your notes on the business cards, you remember later, you wanna follow up with these people 24 to 48 hours later because that's the sweet spot for I'm not overeager and I'm not, uh, you have time to decompress from the event, but you haven't quite forgotten about me yet.

Dani Raschel Chou: Exactly, and it's o- please, please send the email even if there's no, like, obvious tie in. You know, we both work in construction adjacent industry, architect, engineering related industries. If I meet, for example, a, a banker or a, another marketing person, I don't have the ability right then and there, right?

We have someone on our team already who does marketing or who does our website, so we don't have that need. But there may be someone in the future you could connect them with and vice versa. Send the email, "It was so great to meet you. I would love to stay in touch. I would love to see, um, I would love to just keep following up on your journey."

Just something that acknowledges you met them. You don't have to go any further. If there's no obvious connection at that moment, it's okay.

Nicki: Exactly. And any specific ties you can have to the conversation is where you're going to feel more authentic and genuine. Mm-hmm. Nobody wants an AI-generated email that feels like you copied and pasted it to 20 people.

Dani Raschel Chou: Yep.

Nicki: So just take that little bit of time to create the genuine message.

Dani Raschel Chou: 100%. Thank you for speaking to that. It can be, you know, as someone who wants to remain human first and AI forward, because I do feel AI is, genie's out of the bottle. It's here. Use it. Be AI literate, but don't lose your humanness in it.

And I was told, for people who have trouble writing, AI helps so much because you're no longer staring at a blank page. It gives you a springboard. It gives you a foundation to build on. That's the key, springboard, foundation. Don't just automatically send what it first generates for you. Go back in there.

Put some of yourself in that email.

Nicki: When it comes to networking Really have a goal before you show up. And I think this kinda comes full circle, you know, talking about the end in mind, where we're sending these genuine messages, we've built a connection, and we're at a point where we're building this community. So when you go to these events, the goal isn't to meet every single person there.

I would say aim for three meaningful conversations where you are actually getting to know somebody, one helpful introduction, or one person you genuinely wanna follow up with. Yeah. That I feel like gives you a good metric for was this a good networking event?

Dani Raschel Chou: Yep. And you may surprise yourself. I wanted to touch on there's a really big event locally that's really great, Dallas Meetup It is huge. It, it's massive, and it's agnostic, so you get people from all walks of life, all journeys on their career paths.

And I met the most interesting young woman. When I went to go introduce myself, I complimented her, which is another way, if you have no way to get in to, to greet someone, compliment a necklace, their watch. Be genuine. 'Cause they can tell if you're just making it up.

I told her, "You look boarding school chic." And she said, "Thank you." That's actually what she was, she was going for , so she was happy with the compliment. She encouraged me. We just got talking. I told her I would love to be a background actress on Frisco King, and she said, "Well, why haven't you applied?"

And I love Gen Z's mentality of just go out and do the thing, right? And I told her, "Well, I don't have my tattoo releases. I'm heavily tattooed." And she goes, "That doesn't... There's, makeup nowadays can do so much. I dated someone who was a bodybuilder, and he covered up his tattoos when he went on stage. It's possible."

And I genuinely enjoyed speaking with her, because she was just so full of, of joy and energy, and she was very passionate about fashion, that, again, when people show up as their authentic and genuine selves, it'll, it'll just, you don't have to force it. It'll just naturally come out of you. So that's, that's the lesson there.

Show up as yourself, because naturally it's just gonna flow from you. She, we followed each other on Instagram. That doesn't always happen at networking events. You don't just immediately become Instagram buddies. So we followed each other, and the following week she sent me a casting call for a background actress in Frisco King, and I said, "Fine, I will apply."

And I followed up with her. I thought it was hilarious. I said, "Well, I didn't get picked, but my car got picked." And it was just funny, but she helped me accomplish this goal of being a background actress in Frisco King And that all happened because I went to Dallas Meetup and said hi to this girl whose outfit was top-notch.

Nicki: There's so much to being open and genuine with people that you meet about what your goals are and what you're trying to accomplish. Because at our core, I do believe people want to help other people succeed. And it, this is just a great example of how you showed up. You were vulnerable about something that had been on your heart and that you were excited about, and you're like, "I don't know."

And wow, it just opened a door. You were able to talk to somebody, and it opened a door.

Dani Raschel Chou: It sure did.

Nicki: I know.

Dani Raschel Chou: what I was gonna go to. When people think of networking events, sometimes it gives them the ick. One of the... Do we still say that? I don't know.

Nicki: Yeah.

Dani Raschel Chou: We still gives them the ick?

Nicki: Yeah.

Dani Raschel Chou: You'll hear people say, "Ugh, networking events, they're so transactional. People just are in it for themselves and just want something out of it. They just want, you know, your credit card number."

Nicki: I believe it's more about your intention and how you're planning on showing up in that space.

'Cause you can completely change the trajectory of any event that you go to with how you show up, your intent, and what questions you're gonna go and ask.

Dani Raschel Chou: I mean, you gotta WIIFM.

Nicki: Exactly. What's in it for me?

Dani Raschel Chou: Yep.

Nicki: For obviously for the people you're talking to. Yes, yes. If it's all about me, then it does become transactional.

Dani Raschel Chou: Yes, yes. When, when you are networking, when you're going to these events, it's... I, in the past I've referred to them as connecting events. Again, it helps frame the mindset of being a go giver, right? And I've spoken to the book before, how can you help others? That's what they're thinking. What's in it for me?

I mean, at the heart, that's kind of psychologically, that's what we're all thinking. So help the other person, connect them. I mean, we can't stress that enough. Who can they meet that's gonna change their lives at that event? Be that person to make the introduction. You'll be remembered.

So Ni- Nicki, we would be doing everyone a disservice if you didn't share a networking story from the trenches yourself.

Nicki: Yes. There is an absolutely phenomenal woman who put on a local networking event called Chicks with Stix. S-T, sticks.

Dani Raschel Chou: I love that.

Nicki: And she made an observation that there are not enough women out on the golf course.

Dani Raschel Chou: Hmm.

Nicki: And a lot of women felt inadequate about getting out there. They didn't know the game, didn't know how to swing a club, didn't know what club was appropriate for getting out on the golf course, yet so much business does, it happens on the golf course. And I heard about this event, and I was like, "You know what? I am terrible at golf."

So everybody in my family, phenomenal golfers. I don't know how they do it. The golf gene missed me. I actually went to Top Topgolf once upon a time and was trying to hit some balls, and they said, "Ma'am, you should really stop drinking," and I had to tell them, "I have not had anything to drink. I'm really just that bad," to which they apologized.

So you can understand the level of novice that I'm coming at this with when I show up to Chicks with Stix at the PGA in Frisco. Very cool place if you g- ever get a chance. They do have lessons there. Um, so I show up. I ended up meeting a terrific group of about 20 women, um, starting all the way from beginner, never picked up a golf club, to I've been out on a course and I've, I've played...

I forget how many holes are on a course. That's how much I know about golf. Um, but they, they, they knew the game. And I went out there and I sucked. Guys, I royally sucked, but I gave it my all. And you know what? They had some really cool putting games. I learned to putt. I'm pretty sure I could own at least a toddler at this point at putting.

Um, but talk about a way where you're showing up to network with people and be vulnerable. But let me... Like, that level of being vulnerable and showing up, I think actually added to the camaraderie of the people that were there. So we had some laughs. We were able to laugh at ourselves. We were able to bond over the learning experience, which was so cool, and then I just met the most terrific people that are in the AEC industry, so architecture, engineering, construction industry here in DFW.

Dani Raschel Chou: And you're listening to this and want to make more of an effort to go to events, you can find someone who's more experienced in your company to go with and ask them to go with you, and tell them the intent, "I want to learn how to do this thing.

I think you're pretty amazing at it. Will you go with me and show me, help me?" That's another way to grow.

Nicki: Yes. Phone a friend. It really is that easy. Phone a friend, anybody that's at your company. I think you'd be amazed by just asking the question, saying, "Hey, I'm really interested in networking, growing my network. Can you help me?"

Dani Raschel Chou: And it speaks again to, I feel, and maybe I'm too, I'm too naive, people at their heart do genuinely want to help. So when you put out the call, you'll find someone who, 9 times out of 10, unless they have something scheduled, they'll go with you.

Nicki: Yes. I mean, I've worked at multi-million dollar companies where you might think those executives are completely out of reach, and I have yet to be anywhere that that's truly the case.

I've been in those companies where I was even able to just go to lunch with an executive just to talk to them and learn from them. And networking is such an easy way for them to help you build your network, because for somebody to get to that level, that took a lot of years of work, effort, practice. I mean, why not shoot your shot?

Dani Raschel Chou: 100%. So this episode was a bit different, more, more takeaway, more not... Sharing some stories about our time spent networking, some of the good moments, some of the bad. But at its heart, we are wanting to help others level up their success.

These are ways that we have found when we go to events that have made them joyful.

Nicki: The only way out is through. Just rip off the Band-Aid. Go be uncomfortable.

Dani Raschel Chou: Thank you so much, Nicki, for sitting down with us and giving us a, a 101 lesson in networking.

Nicki: Thank you so much. Always a blast to talk networking with you.

Dani Raschel Chou: Before you go, let me hand you the whole thing in one piece. Before the event, business cards with your name, your company, your phone, and your email printed on paper you can write on, a pen, two minutes on the guest list, and the name of whoever's hosting. In the room, name tag on your right, drink in your left, and go stand near whoever just walked in.

In the conversation, skip, "What do you do?" Ask what they're working on that they're excited about, or ask who would be a helpful person for them to meet, then ask the follow-up instead of talking about yourself. On the way out, "I'm going to keep making the rounds, but I'd love to stay in touch." No apology.

The next day or the day after that, but not any longer, send the email in your words, not a robot's. And the only goal worth setting: three real conversations, not 30 business cards. That's right. Three. All of it's in the show notes. Now, go be uncomfortable. This is the With Hat and Cattle promise. We bring you stories from people who walk the walk and leave you better off for listening.

Now, if this episode resonated, be sure you forward it to someone who could also use networking help. That's how we get better. A rising tide lifts all ships, right? We'll see you next week.